This movie made me remember how much I love wrestling. And I know you may think that sounds ridiculous, but wrestling is kinda awesome. It brought back memories of watching WWF after church on Sundays while eating the candy our grandparents let us pick out on the way home. Back before they were sued by the World Wildlife Federation and had to change their acronym to WWE, which just doesn’t sound as cool. But the professional wrestling culture isn’t too unlike the science fiction culture, or any culture that encourages a strong and unique fanbase. There’s a sense of brotherhood when a crowd of fans get together for a big event. Whether it be the opening night of Star Wars, or a wrestling match where everyone chants “Use his leg!” when a man offers his prosthetic leg for a wrestler to use against his opponent. And no, it’s not trashy, so put your judgy hat away, because around here we only judge people who are into watersports. Wrestling (and fandom in general) is about pure, unabashed fun, and this movie reminded me of that fact. Mickey Rourke was phenomenal, and I’ll be rooting for him on Oscar night. I was right there with him during his highs and lows (both deli scenes come to mind for both sides of the spectrum) of the movie and I was incredibly impressed, especially considering that I went into the movie not thinking very highly of him. I definitely recommend seeing it before Oscar night! For any of you who have seen it, I’m curious to hear what you thought of the last scene and final shot. I thought they were perfect.
I know, I know, I’m super late to the Twilight party. I assumed I missed my chance at seeing this movie since it came out so long ago, but my Dad just finished the first book, and he wanted to see the movie bad, so we had to track it down somewhere. There was only one theater on Long Island still playing it, and they only had one time, but we made it. And no, the theater wasn’t empty. It was me, Dad, and a load of women spanning a wide age range. So needless to say, there was a lot of squealing every time (still two flipping words!) a cute vampire came on screen, but my Dad would just elbow me in the side and I’d stop. But seriously, I have to admit, the movie was pretty great, and loads of fun. I know I scoffed when people said how great the books are, I mean seriously, vampire romance? But the last time I scoffed at a book, it was a little series called Harry Potter, so I guess I’m going to have to start reading the Twilight books now. It’s a little disappointing knowing what will happen in the first book, but I have a feeling I’ll still enjoy it, and there are still three other books for me to enjoy without being spoiled. What I enjoyed most about the movie (besides the music, which I downloaded the soundtrack already) was how everyone pretty much got along, besides the bad guys of course. There weren’t any over the top mean girls at school, or traitors in their midst, plus the baseball scene during the thunderstorm was ridiculous and wonderful. It was just a really well done cheesy teen movie with vampires. What’s not to love?
Craig, I am so glad you enjoyed The Wrestler, I loved it. This type of movie is what needs to come out of Hollywood a little more. Not huge budget, not indie, but in between leaning to indie…time for you to really see a Mickey movie and rent Barfly with your gin and tonics…”Drinks, drinks for all my friends…”
Wow, you liked Twilight huh? My daughter refused to see it because she loved the books and devoured them although she was a Jacob (Jasper?) fan. She was sure it would be not as good as the book as so many movies aren’t. I guess we’ll see it on video just to say we did. I love vampire romance but I like mine with bit more blood and nekkidness than Stephanie Meyers writes. I never liked wrestling, still don’t, won’t be seeing Mickey.
Tam: Maybe if you opened up to a great movie like the wrestler your daughter might open up to a great movie like Twilight…and The wrestler isn’t so much about wrestling as it is about life.
Holy crap, now you’re getting me interested in seeing a teen vampire 90210esque romance. What’s next? “Nails on a Chalkboard: The Musical?” “Forrest Gump 2: Gumpier Old Man?” …sigh… My daughter reads the books voraciously. She says they’re not very well-written, but real page-turners. We’ll be renting the DVD when it comes out and sitting down and watching it. Nothing says father-daughter time than vampires having teen sex…
And because you enjoyed it so much, I may actually take the time to see a Mickey Rourke film.
But he’s still damn hard to look at…
God, where do I start with this one.
First, I loved The Wrestler, Mickey Rourke had me completely absorbed the entire time and I just found myself gasping and drawn in to the story in every way. It’s hard to because Sean Penn is so good in Milk, but Rourke def deserves the best actor Oscar just for the way the movie made me actually give a shit about the character and at the same time, made me feel every crushing blow so hard that it didn’t feel like a movie at all.
Second, oh Twilight, you evil little movie you. I hated Twilight the first 30 or so mins into it, in fact, I couldn’t help but make fun of how cheesy it was and how Edward seemed to be wearing more lipstick than Bella. Slowly though I started to come round, and than the bedroom scene happened, and the moment he threw Bella on the bed I lost it. I was a 14 yr old girl, lost completely in the movie and squealing every time he came on the screen. This girl Jenny I watched it with (she forced me) just smiled as I’m like, omg, omg. Of course, her boyfriend Mike, one of my oldest and dearest friends now thinks I’m “queerer than a three dollar bill,” for my love of Edward.
I got all the books and I’m the middle of reading Twilight atm and I kid you not, I find myself swooning with every page. Not only are they easy reads (I fly through about a 100 pages in a sitting) but the entire time, I find myself says aloud to the empty room, “Oh Edward!”
Yeah … my life is fucking sad. However, grats sir on seeing two of the better movies that came out this year. I’m currently going through all the best pic noms but fell asleep during Slumdog Millionaire last night.
Dave: But they DON’T have teen sex until after they are married (book 3 or 4). That was Stephanie Meyers big thing, she’s a Mormon who refused to write premarital sex into the books despite publishers attempts to get her to spice them up. We’ll watch it on DVD too, but I don’t plan on reading the books. Also first person narrative which tends to send me buggy.
Hayden: I don’t really mind if she doesn’t open up to teeny vampire movies. LOL
Dr. Para: So they had sex in the movie? Yep, my daughter’s thoughts were right. Major changes compared to the book. My mistake Dave. Sorry, enjoy your father/daughter bonding.
Tam: No sex, he just throws her on the bed cause Bella is a whore and wants to get the goods. They than lay there and just sorta exist, which reminded me of this boy I spoon with (let’s call him Evil Bonzo.) Ironically, I’ve noticed that in the movie they played her sluttiness down a bit.
Dave S.: “vampires having teen sex…” well this is all I needed to hear to watch the movies/read the books.
Tam: So if you’re a Mormon, you can’t write about premarital sex, but it’s peachy keen okay to write about the walking undead and someone falling in love with them (necrophelia anyone?) *SIGH*….
Craiggers: I’m sorry, I don’t believe I’ll be seeing Wrestler, despite your glowing review. I just can’t get past Mickey Rourke and the homophobic comments he made earlier. When it comes to a homophobe or someone playing a historical gay martyr, I’ll root for the latter over the former to win the trophy every single time. Which I know has really nothing to do with their respective performances, but, well that’s how I am sometimes. I’m glad you enjoyed it though.
HUGS…
I’m with Polt. I’m sure Rourke’s performance was as brilliant as everyone says but I can’t cheer for a blatant homophobic dick. I’m one of those crazy people who can’t separate an artist from their work if I fucking hate the artist (for example, Orson Scott Card will never see a nickel from me ever again).
Trust me, Craig, there are better people (and performances) to cheer for come Oscar night.
Polt: Umm, don’t ask me about Mormon rules. I’m a heathen. Besides, vampires are hot!
Brian F.: Your blog’s tagline is hilarious: “Poised for success, prepared for hot, flaming death.”
Personally, I’m able to overlook any personal bigotry and character flaws to get into a performance. I mean, I was able to enjoy Tom Cruise in War of the Worlds despite my extreme hatred that I project toward Scientology… :-/ Of course, Tom won’t ever get an Oscar unless it’s a green furry one that lives in a trashcan.
Are we calling Mickey Rourke homophobic because he called a paparazi a fag? If so, is Shia LaBeouf a homophobe, or does he get a free pass cause he’s cute? I’ve been known to use the word cocksucker when I’m angry. Does that make me a homophobe?
Orson Scott Card I can understand because he has specifically rallied against gay marriage.
Just because Sean Penn played a gay guy, doesn’t make him a hero in my eyes. It’s Oscar-bait. Doesn’t everyone remember his lame defense of Jude Law at the Oscars after Chris Rock made fun of him? He’s a douche.
That’s just my humble opinion. Gotta run back to training! It’s all week! Ugh!
Craig: Wow, you are going to be moving up the corporate ladder at the speed of light with all this new knowledge you are gaining this week. Or you’re be a party-line spouting drone. One or the other.
I never gave Shia LeBeouf a pass. He’s an asshole. And I don’t think he’s that cute at all. And I didn’t defend Sean Penn.
Cocksucker is not the same as fag. It’s just not. And intent is a prime factor. If you use the term to disparage someone, indicating that in some way being homosexual is a bad thing and that it’s something someone should be ashamed of, then yes, you’re a homophobe. Gays can be homophobes too. They’re typically called “self-loathing gays” and I know plenty. I’m not calling you out, Craig. I’m simply saying that it can, and does, happen.
Dave, I respect your willingness to overlook an actor’s personal life and appreciate a good performance. I just can’t do it. I can’t pay money for a movie ticket or a book that I know provides financial support to someone with a reprehensible outlook. Mel Gibson’s career took a hit when he was revealed as an anti-Semite. His career’s not over but he’s not as bankable as he once was. And that’s because people said it wasn’t OK for him to behave that way and they stopped supporting him. And that’s what I choose to do about Mickey Rourke, Orson Scott Card, and Tom Cruise. But, again, I respect that you’re able to make that separation.
Yeah, I’m going to jump on the disagree wagon with this one. I get the whole, “Omg, he’s a homophobe, boycott him” idea but I personally watch movies to enjoy and escape reality. To me words are words, anyone who is deeply and personally affected by the words of a celebrity that you will probably never meet and has not had a career for the longest time is of no concern to me. I look at the work and judge from there.
I haven’t seen The Wrestler yet, but am looking forward to it. I’m not and have never been a fan of wrestling, but I’ve heard only good about it. I also hear Marisa Tomei was pretty amazing in it.
I’m surprised by the reactions to Twilight. I’ve only heard, from reputable sources, that the books aren’t that good. I’ve heard the first was good, but they go down hill pretty fast. I will couch that with the fact that I haven’t read them myself, nor have I seen the movie.
As for boycotting, I’m all for people doing what they feel is the right thing for them to do (meaning that if you feel you have to boycott, not if you feel it is right to persecute others). Some things I can overlook, but some things are inexcusable.
As for homophobia, when the hell are people going to learn love is love, who cares about the plumbing (as long as it is between consensual adults).
I’ll just say that Brian F. said it better than I could ever hope to, so I’ll concur with his opinion.
As for boycotting, I’m not trying to rally people into not seeing the Wrestler, I was only saying for me, I have no desire to see it because I beleive Rourke to be a homophobe. If someone else wants to see it, that’s up to them. And I will be rooting for Sean Penn over Rourke for the same reason, but I’m not gonna get upset if Rourke does win, cause really, I have no stake in the outsome at all. Its not like I’m betting money on the winner or anything, ya know?
Didn’t mean to start a whole controversy here….but I’ll just chalk it up to what my friend calls “The Polt-Chaos” which follows me whereever I go.
HUGS…
Oh and I do think Shia LeBeouf is kinda cute, so I’ll give him a free anything he wants.
HUGS…
Alright, so since it’s, like, right in front of my face (no pun intended), I gotta address the whole use of the word “homophobic,” which is so often used incorrectly as an umbrella adjective to describe anyone who disagrees with the homosexual lifestyle. It’s like calling someone an anti-semite simply because they don’t agree with the Jewish faith. A true homophobe has to have an irrational fear of homosexuality present — and unless you’re in the head of a person, you simply don’t know their reasoning or thinking behind it. Many religions — Muslim, Christianity, Mormonism, Judaism — have specific moral issues with it that have nothing to do with fear. Again, it would be like labeling someone that approves of abortion a tocophobe (the irrational fear of pregnancy & childbirth) without really knowing *why* they’re pro-choice.
I have friends that don’t approve of the homosexual lifestyle, while at the same time having close friendships with both gays and lesbians. Are they homophobic? Absolutely not. There’s no fear involved. In fact, they extend just as much love toward them as anyone else does — sometimes more. Just because you don’t agree with it doesn’t mean it breeds fear or hatred.
I say all this because I just don’t want folks to pitch the same level of so-called ‘fear’ and ‘hatred’ toward those that you might want to label homophobic. Because isn’t that kinda lumping them all together in the same way we’re so often fighting against?
Okay, none of that probably makes sense at all.
I’ll step off my soapbox now.
(can you tell that I despise labels…?)
Dave S.: If I get pissed off at someone at call them “fag”, that’s pretty much showing that I don’t have much respect for “fags”, or why use it in that way? In addition, if someone (like Rourke) calls someone else a fag, without knowing anything about them, that shows his thoughts on gays in general. I mean, if a paparazzi pisses him off, does he yell “Kike” or “Spic” at them, when they don’t obviously look Jewish or Hispanic? No, he doesn’t. So then why yell ‘fag’ at someone without knowing their orientation? The only reason would be because you hold homosexuals in such contempt that you attempt to insult and denegrate someone you don’t know by calling them “fag”.
I don’t know if Rourke ‘hates’ fags just because he used that work, but I imagine if he screamed “nigger” at someone, there’d be little doubt that he was racist…or at the very least, a NOT nice and insensitve person. And even at ‘just’ that, I’d still not want him to win any awards. Which again, has nothing to do with the performance. I just don’t like it when people that aren’t good people, get rewards (see George W. Bush [oooo, opened a whole OTHER can of worms there, didn't I?])
Okay,I’ve babbled on long enough. I’m done. I’ll just say again, I’m glad you enjoyed the movie, Craiggers, I’d hate you waste your time and money on a movie you didn’t enjoy (like last years ‘The Day The Earth Stood Still’.)
HUGS…
I think (for what it is worth) that you both have points. I’m not a fan of labeling people either, but I have less of a problem labeling behavior (behavior can be changed).
I think referring to someone as “fag” can be labeled homophobic behavior as it perpetuates the used of a slur, regardless if the object of the slur is homosexual or not. I feel the same way about the use of “nigger”, “spic”, etc.
On a related note, I have a question about the use of some words. I’ve heard the argument made that some groups use some words I consider slurs with each other. Does this happen in the LBGT community? I hear “queen” tossed around quite a bit (drama, bitchy, size, etc.) is “fag” used in a similar way?
john: Referring to someone as a fag isn’t homophobic behavior, it’s simply either showing hatred, dislike, or bigotry, but not necessarily fear — an element intrinsic to the suffix ‘phobic’. Homophobia has turned into a socio-political word used by the LGBT community to swing at anything and anyone that doesn’t go along with their agenda. Now don’t get me wrong — I agree with a lot of their agenda — but I absolutely abhor the use of any word that essentially puts down an individual or group for simply disagreeing. The word is used strategically to show that the opposing point of view is irrational and ignorant (since both are essentially the base of the word ‘phobia’). Unfortunately, the use of such words shuts down communication. For example, I think the theory of evolution (yes, folks, it’s still a theory) is not reputable, but should I then call an evolutionist ignorant and irrational? Of course not — because that would cause back-and-forth learning from both sides to end. It ultimately becomes combative rather than helpful.
Polt: I agree with you on those points, for sure.
Dave S.: Point taken, I wasn’t clear in my response. I understand what you are saying about the suffix “phobic” and agree to the extent that it may be a misnomer for the actions of some people. I placed too much emphasis on the labeling of a person part of the discussion rather than the label itself.
john: Yeah, and I apologize for jumping on that tiny little point. Just smash that damn soapbox before I get on it again…
Craig is going to be pissed when he gets back from training today and reads how far we’ve gotten off the topic…
(Sorry, Craig. Loveyoumeanit…) 
If it makes anyone feel better, let me just say that I borrowed The Wrestler from a friend. Shiver me timbers!
Dave S.: No worries at all and no need to apologize. You hardly harped, it wasn’t like you were caps lock Dave S. there.
We might have trouble smashing that soapbox, it has been supporting a number of us today, sometimes all at once. That sucker has to be strong.
Craig: Y’know, I have some spare wrestlers in my basement. I would’ve let you borrow one…
Dave S.: And yet you never offered ME a wrestler when I was there! Perhaps you knew what I would have done with it, eh?
HUGS…
Craig: If it makes you feel any better, the last movie I saw at the theater was The Strangers … and I’ve seen almost everything that has come out since then.
“I have friends that don’t approve of the homosexual lifestyle”
….
I’m sorry, what? “The homosexual lifestyle?” People still use that phrase?
Egad.
Homosexual Lifestyle = Raves. Meth. Hanging out at playgrounds. Making sweet sweet love to a sheep. Being sassy.
And the agenda Craig! You musn’t forget about the Hidden Agenda that is part and parcel of “The Lifestyle”…(rolls eyes)
That’s something I enjoyed about Twilight, too. The high school kids all seemed much more genuine and much less cliched than most movies.
Avitable: I totally agree. I was tormented in Junior High, but when you get to High School no one gives a damn anymore.
Polt: I agree with you on principal, but man, you’re taking the ‘agenda’ too far. What is the gay lifestyle? For me, it’s waking up in the morning, going to work, doing my job, hanging out with my friends, and sleeping at night. I think most people who use ‘fag’ are using it because they don’t know better. Mickey Rourke is probably one of those. I wouldn’t vote against him because he of his personal stance on gays. This is about ACTING. And he nailed it. I’ve seen Sean Penn and he nailed it, but does he bring the role home? I don’t know.
For me, personally, I think Melissa Leo was the best actress of 2008. Nobody saw her movie? Too bad. You’re missing out. You want to talk about movies that matter, see that movie. I thought the whole gay-debate was done years ago – why are we still bringing it up?
Oh and thanks for reminding me of the second Deli scene. I had managed to block that entire scene from my memory until you had mentioned it.
[...] like a hypocrite for judging Twilight without having watched it. Since Craig also got around to giving it chance this week (and liked it), I figured it wouldn’t kill me to watch the [...]